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On Penn State, Joe Paterno, and Our Culture of Shame

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Thoughts after the jump, with two warnings and a promise: there is a very, very sensitive issue at the heart of this and it's one that's likely to be upsetting to some. I understand how emotionally charged it is, and difficult it is to grasp, but I respectfully ask that you not make any jokes about it, period, in the comments. No amount of levity can make this situation laughable, and I will be vigilant in the comments to ensure that we treat this with the proper gravity.

Second, though this disclaimer is true of every post at Alligator Army: The views discussed under my name are mine alone, and may not be representative of my employers or the community as a whole.

The promise: We're discussing this here and here alone. I just sort of need to write all of this down, and this seems like as good a place as any to do it.

Star-divide

I think the most important reason Joe Paterno was fired Wednesday night because he didn't resign immediately on Wednesday morning. The inestimable Brian Floyd has a timeline of events from Wednesday at SB Nation, and includes this quote from Paterno:

That's why I have decided to announce my retirement effective at the end of this season. At this moment the Board of Trustees should not spend a single minute discussing my status. They have far more important matters to address. I want to make this as easy for them as I possibly can.

The easiest thing the Board of Trustees could have done? Accept Paterno's immediate resignation. Paterno attempting to dictate his own terms forced the Board to dictate them for him; Paterno using "should" to direct his superiors not to fire him while half the world pilloried him for doing what he had to do and stopping short of what he should have done is was probably a dark irony not lost on the Board. Paterno had a choice: He could leave or be forced to leave. He chose the latter.

I think the Board was right to fire Paterno, because keeping him in Penn State's employ was definitely not in the university's best interest. I understand the frustration some Penn State fans and students have with how it happened — over the phone, at night, in the middle of a media maelstrom — but I cannot fault the what of the Board's decision.

But firing Paterno and Graham Spanier is almost easy, at this point; it's getting rid of figureheads who looked the other way when there were reasons to believe some of the darkest evil a human can do to another was happening. The real task before Penn State is much more difficult than that, and may require many of the powers that be there and everywhere to look at how we handle alleged abuses of power. 

Consider, for a moment, how incredibly disappointing it is that Jerry Sandusky allegedly repeatedly and brazenly took advantage of, molested, and raped children — at one point, in the locker room at Penn State's football facilities — without even a soul speaking out about it.

Sandusky retired from Penn State in 1999, after an incident that led to him being investigated for sexual abuse in 1998. Here's an ugly dichotomy: Apparently, The Second Mile, the charity Sandusky apparently met many children through, knew about that 1998 investigation and did very little; the mother of the Victim 1 described in the grand jury report on Sandusky (PDF, with graphic details), called her son's school with an allegation of sexual abuse by Sandusky in 2006, and Steve Turchetta, an assistant principal and football coach at that school (he has now been elevated to athletic director), got Sandusky banned by that school district from that day forward.

It's hard and wrong to generalize and extrapolate from that, but it seems that The Second Mile, an organization dedicated to bettering the lives of children, allowed a predator to remain in their midst, while a school and a school district took the best step of anyone in this saga.

Why, though? Why does a school district, or a teacher, make that decision, while a graduate assistant makes the decision, after confronting his own father, to run a rape he allegedly witnessed up the flagpole, and a head coach decides to do the same, and no one decides it was important enough to tell people beyond the Penn State cocoon about it? Was there a fear that there would be retribution associated with accusing Sandusky of a crime? Was there a worry that telling police that a football coach was also a rapist would destroy what Paterno and others had built? Was there disbelief that a trusted friend could also be capable of monstrous evil?

Was there shame in having witnessed Sandusky rape a child?

The issue of how we view rape is very, very difficult to deal with, and one of the most important ones for people who work against what they (we, really, because I count myself in this group) call rape culture. Rape culture is an umbrella term for all the things that enable people to consider the willful violation of another person's sexual consent less than a gravely serious and violent crime, and usually focuses on how many aspects of culture can be used to normalize and trivialize sexual violence against women. But while that Wikipedia page mostly pertains to sexual violence against women, literally anyone can be raped by anyone, and a culture that does anything but react with horror to sexual abuse and support for those who are victimized by it can be damaging to its citizens.

If Mike McQueary was swayed by any part of that culture to do react as he did in the Penn State locker room that night, instead of attempting to stop a rape and a rapist by immediately calling police, I think McQueary's failing is greater than his own. Though, in a perfect world, no one should ever be raped, no one should ever have to see a rape occur, either, and McQueary was confronted with a rare situation he was probably unequipped to handle. And though I can't profess to know his mind, I do think he probably felt shame, and was shocked, by the situation, and left unable to act appropriately both by his education and acculturation to that point in his life.

And if there are more of us who are as unequipped as McQueary was (or who have to ask ourselves what we would do in that situation) than there are who can confidently say we would work to prevent sexual violence, there is a serious imbalance in the scales of shame here. There should be no more shame in being raped or sexually abused than being murdered, or otherwise being the victim of a crime, and no shame in witnessing it and trying to do something to stop it; there should be plenty of shame for those with the power to stop rape and sexual abuse who allow them to occur unchecked.

There's another quote from Joe Paterno that I think is important today. It's inscribed on a wall behind a statue on Penn State's campus.

There is a three-sided stone wall behind the statue. The left section of the wall reads, "Joseph Vincent Paterno: Educator, Coach, Humanitarian."

The middle section of the wall features four Nittany Lion football players following Paterno, who is depicted running onto the field with his right index finger extended. Also in the middle section of the wall is a quote from the legendary coach: "They ask me what I'd like written about me when I'm gone. I hope they write I made Penn State a better place, not just that I was a good football coach."

Paterno helped many young men and women as the coach of Penn State's football team, and probably ultimately made Penn State a better place, through mentoring and coaching and successfully piloting a football program that made money hand over fist and allowed students to study in nice libraries. It's my hope that, as the former coach of Penn State, he will help many more young men and women see that the shame associated with sexual abuse must be reserved for those who do not diligently work to exterminate it.

And if he doesn't, we should remember that, too — and learn from it.

To learn about how you can help survivors of rape, abuse, incest, and neglect, visit Black Shoe Diaries' post on the Proud to Be a Penn Stater campaign. For more on the Sandusky investigation, read SB Nation's comprehensive StoryStream.

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Well put.

"I’ll tell you one thing: The grass at Tiger Stadium tastes best."
"Woeojuwejhdjwe"
"We made a couple special teams Fu Pas...Fu Pas. F-U-P-A. Okay. Fu Pa. Maybe an 'H.'"

by LesMilesEatsGrass on Nov 10, 2011 1:51 PM EST reply actions  

Very well put, Andy.

I think an important factor in all this that’s been overlooked is the role of cronyism.

Mike McQueary played for Paterno. Curley (the AD) played for Paterno. Hell, even Sandusky played for Paterno.

So many people on that staff and in that department are Paterno worshippers. I don’t think many people are grasping just how much PSU was Joe Paterno.

So it doesn’t surprise me that McQueary went to Paterno before the police. It also wouldn’t surprise me if Curley, when he saw that Paterno passed it up the chain rather than call the police, decided “if Joe didn’t call, I’m not going to call.”

PSU willingly gave over every ounce of themselves as a program and athletic department to Joe Paterno, and that is why there was no oversight, and no one to step in and make the choice Joe was too cowardly to make.

This is the biggest failure in the history of college athletics. Everyone, and I mean everyone, has to go. From the lowliest, irrelevant assistant all the way up to King of State College himself, no program in the history of history has ever needed to clean house more.

This is now Paterno’s legacy. If he or anyone else doesn’t like that, he should have made the right choice at any point between now and nine damn years ago.

Oh, come on. Don't leave your uncle T-bag hangin'.

by Troll2Troll on Nov 10, 2011 1:52 PM EST reply actions  

That’s almost always how the story unfolds. With everyone. And it will with all of us one day. Nearly every person that has ever lived, has seen their greatest attribute, become their weakest link.

The only difference is, when that moment happens. With Paterno, it may have happened too late.

Editor at Alligator Army - The Florida Gators Blog
The Florida Gators - The most despised team in all of college football - Which is fantastic.

by FlaGators on Nov 10, 2011 2:08 PM EST up reply actions  

Also, feel free to donate to the charity at BSD

but don’t go to the comments. The staff at BSD have been doing a great job, but the commenters are a disgrace. Absolutely deplorable people there.

Oh, come on. Don't leave your uncle T-bag hangin'.

by Troll2Troll on Nov 10, 2011 1:54 PM EST reply actions   1 recs

there have been some pretty sad reactions to all of this...

I don’t pretend to know how hard it is for PSU fans, and alumni, to see this happen to their school, but for there to a be a significantly larger outcry (both online and in person) to the firing of Paterno, than there was to the alleged rape of numerous young boys is disturbing. I don’t know that the BoT acted perfectly, and their press conference was a disaster, but as Andy said above…" but I cannot fault the what of the Board’s decision."

This is a sad day in college football, because Paterno was IMO the last great coach of his ilk. The last coach that I believed truly cared more about his ideals, and integrity than wins and losses. I’m forced to reevaluate that perception, because what is unfolding in front of me, does not seem to match the vision I’ve held of Paterno. Considering the tragedy that has befallen Happy Valley and those children, and the resulting fall from grace, I will will admit that today, my confidence in mankind is a bit shaken. A sad day indeed.

contributing author - Alligator Army

by Cardsfan25 on Nov 10, 2011 2:22 PM EST up reply actions  

to me, this is typical remote management

horrible thing happens
knee jerk reaction is to do something that makes it seem like you are accepting responsibility and taking action
so, you fire the most important people at the school
this makes you feel better, and people think you aren’t the irresponsible people you know you are
no indictment of joe pa because he didn’t break the law
same for spanier
if we’re looking for the people to hang, start with the vp and ad whose responsibility it was to pursue this, and think about the potential civil law suits that may be spawned by this whole business
the vp and ad were sacked immediately, but it didn’t assuage the situation, so they start with moral issues and go after higher profile people
worse, it deflects attention away from sandusky and the victims
among all the irresponsible people, how does the penn state hr director still have a job?
should joe pa and spanier ultimately prove blameless, i have no idea. who knew what, no idea, but hopefully this will get accurately sorted out and the guilty pay appropriately

TLR is gone, long live the king

by sportsman on Nov 10, 2011 8:48 PM EST up reply actions   1 recs

Well said

To draw a comparison to another current event just look at Herman Cain and what the media have allowed to go on. I understand that Herman Cain has not been accused of rape or child molestation, but people need to understand that sexual harassment is tied into rape culture. All of these things are about someone in a more powerful position taking advantage of someone in a less powerful position, the end.

There is a narrative that political pundits have been spreading that sexual harassment no longer exists and that the women who claim it are either after money or lacking a sense of humor. The fact that we are not furious that a narrative such as this is being disseminated proves Andy’s point about rape culture. If we want to live in a world where without atrocities like the crimes that Jerry Sandusky probably perpetrated do not exist, then we must fight against it at all levels including the level of words because these crimes of power are all interconnected in the ways they function.

by Tractorr on Nov 10, 2011 2:42 PM EST reply actions  

It gets even harder when media members aren't fully equipped to spot things like this.

And American media so often produce “_ said, _ said” binary coverage, of everything from your town’s ballot initiatives to coverage of campaigns for war, that it’s rather distressingly easy for right and wrong to get lost along the way.

by Andy Hutchins on Nov 10, 2011 2:52 PM EST up reply actions  

absitively

they don’t report as much as feed set up questions to people so they can talk to them again

TLR is gone, long live the king

by sportsman on Nov 10, 2011 8:49 PM EST up reply actions  

Wait, I’m confused now. Andy, are you saying that we live in a “rape culture” or that this is something different? Because by the definition you linked to, it says stuff like that is common.

Also, in the interest of full disclosure, I should note that I have never heard the term before. Mostly because I just don’t pay attention when stuff like that comes up on the news.

Editor at Alligator Army - The Florida Gators Blog
The Florida Gators - The most despised team in all of college football - Which is fantastic.

by FlaGators on Nov 10, 2011 2:57 PM EST reply actions  

Oh and that is just the statistics on women not men and children (both of which are severely under reported).

by Tractorr on Nov 10, 2011 3:05 PM EST up reply actions  

One last thing though, that’s kind of not what I was talking about. I should have been more clear on the subject. But then again, as I said below …

I’m glad that I didn’t.

Y’all can enjoy this topic, but it isn’t for me. I’ll sit it out.

Editor at Alligator Army - The Florida Gators Blog
The Florida Gators - The most despised team in all of college football - Which is fantastic.

by FlaGators on Nov 10, 2011 3:13 PM EST up reply actions  

It is disturbingly common.

It’s shocking, once you look for it, how often people go out of their way to excuse or outright allow sexual violence of all types. Just look how much love and support Roman Polanski still receives from all sorts of people. It’s depressing.

Oh, come on. Don't leave your uncle T-bag hangin'.

by Troll2Troll on Nov 10, 2011 3:08 PM EST via mobile up reply actions  

Polanski. Yeah. That dude is a loser though. But that’s Hollywood for ya.

Editor at Alligator Army - The Florida Gators Blog
The Florida Gators - The most despised team in all of college football - Which is fantastic.

by FlaGators on Nov 10, 2011 3:09 PM EST up reply actions  

You know what though, now that I’ve thought about it. I’m going to refrain from commenting any further on the matter.

First and foremost, I don’t want this to get into a political argument. Secondly, we all get along on here by keeping that stuff out of it, and I’d like for that to continue.

Quit while we are ahead, kind of thing. No worries though.

Editor at Alligator Army - The Florida Gators Blog
The Florida Gators - The most despised team in all of college football - Which is fantastic.

by FlaGators on Nov 10, 2011 3:10 PM EST reply actions  

This is not meant as an attack

I only know you from these boards and your posts seem to be rather level headed, so I want to make clear that this is not an attack.

The attitude you are taking is what Andy is trying to point out is part of the problem. Again, I do not mean this as an attack. As Andy said part of the problem is that these things are very difficult to talk about, they make us uncomfortable, and when people do discuss them it often quickly devolves into fighting.

We all are frustrated because these are very hard issues. I agree with you that this might not be the best place to discuss these very difficult issues, but if not now when? Thankfully, these sorts of things don’t effect college football everyday, but when they come up I think it is a good time to have a reasonable conversation to situate the events in a larger cultural context.

For instance, people saying that what happened in Penn State was the action of a single person. That is simply not true. Had more decisive actions been taken as far back as the late 90s then many more assaults would have happened.

by Tractorr on Nov 10, 2011 3:38 PM EST up reply actions  

Thanks and yeah, I understand no attack intended and I didn’t take it as one.

Part of my problem here, is that I don’t know how to say, what I want to say, without offending or upsetting someone or a large group of people. It’s not so much that I don’t think it is an issue, but I don’t think that “rape culture” as described by that definition can be trusted enough to use as a description of a society.

Does it exist? Sure.

Is it a problem? Sure.

But is a societies problem as a whole? Depends on an individual person and their view.

Look at the terms origins. Feminist movement in the 1970’s. That was a weird time and place. For me personally, I’m more worried about the “glass ceiling” that women (and to an extent minorities) deal with on a day-to-day basis, than say … a rape culture.

Editor at Alligator Army - The Florida Gators Blog
The Florida Gators - The most despised team in all of college football - Which is fantastic.

by FlaGators on Nov 10, 2011 3:48 PM EST up reply actions  

Well I think you’re not off base there in that it seems the “glass ceiling” and the rape culture are linked in a part-to-whole relationship. One begets the other, and I can’t say I’m entirely sure which comes first.

I think most people would view rape culture as the broad concept, the tip of the pyramid so to speak, and spread out below that at its base are all matter of social injustices such as the glass ceiling mentality and many other which I’m not qualified to list. Clusters of our society that foster a broader problem. But to your point I think that’s where an individual’s perspective comes into play in terms of how that hierarchy is sorted.

by Ghost of the Purple Porpoise on Nov 10, 2011 4:23 PM EST up reply actions  

That seems like a fair assessment and comparison of the two.

Editor at Alligator Army - The Florida Gators Blog
The Florida Gators - The most despised team in all of college football - Which is fantastic.

by FlaGators on Nov 10, 2011 4:46 PM EST up reply actions  

I posted this in the other thread but since we have an official one now...

All we know…

Is that Joe informed the correct authorities at the Universities. I HIGHLY reccomend reading the PSU blog here on SbNation, they have some really good points.
 
One of the best points I have read is: Looking back on it, it’s clear JoePa should of done more. But to say that he allowed Sandusky to stay on his staff even though he knew about the acts he committed is just an assumption on your part. JoePa could of informed the correct people, and considering the years AND YEARS of perfect behavior on his part, its not a far stretch to believe that he did indeed continue to ask about the issue and where its at and some have stated(no link though) that Joe was informed there was an investigation and that Sandusky and the boy were just horsing around. Thus JoePa leaves it at that. Does anyone know for a fact, this is not what happened? If Joe was duped into some sort of cover up, does he still deserve all of this? I don’t think so.
 
I highly doubt that JoePa was involved in a cover up to protect the program. And I think it is EXTREMELY DISRESPECTFUL to assume that he was. So before we all assume that Joe knew this, and he didn’t do this and that… maybe we should go read up on the issue a little more.
 
IMO: Joe was made an escape goat for the scandal. He made a mistake, but the punishment doesnt justify the mistake if it was innocent and he had no part of some cover up what so ever. If he simply looked the other way, while others did the covering up, than he is right with the people doing the cover up. Now if it comes out that I am wrong, and Joe ws part of a cover up, than he should be prosecuted by the law. But he has earned the respect to be able to finish the season out and let the investigation by the FBI determine who is to blame for this horrible incident not reaching the police, NOT ESPN or CNN.

"When you argue correctly, you're never wrong."-Nick Naylor

by Hook85 on Nov 10, 2011 3:56 PM EST reply actions  

A few things

1) Have you read the Grand Jury report. It is far more damning than you can believe. The number of boys that Sandusky was around, the way he behaved, and the fact that he had them spend the night at his home. This was an ongoing thing and Joe Pa seems to have turned a blind eye to all of it.

2) Sandusky founded Second Mile in 77. He had been coaching at Penn State since 69. I don’t know if you know about the psychology of a child molester but they don’t just start one day. It is a series of what are known as escalations until they go fully into molestation. Odds are Sandusky did not start molesting children in the late 90s it was probably much earlier and Joe Pa knew him that whole time.

3) If we even forget about the above points entirely. Joe Pa also forced the hand of the BoT. Had he come out and said that he would be taking a leave of absence until the investigations were finished then maybe they might not have fired him in this fashion. By taking the stance that he was going to represent the team, this was the only action that the BoT could take.

It is completely impossible for someone who is implicated in a child molestation cover-up to represent a university. It does not matter if down the line he is completely exonerated and it turns out he actually did much more than we know at this time.

by Tractorr on Nov 10, 2011 4:19 PM EST up reply actions  

I agree with this…

It is completely impossible for someone who is implicated in a child molestation cover-up to represent a university. It does not matter if down the line he is completely exonerated and it turns out he actually did much more than we know at this time.

But this would only make sense if they fired everyone involved. Is Paterno the only one who represents PSU that was implicated? The answer is no.

"When you argue correctly, you're never wrong."-Nick Naylor

by Hook85 on Nov 10, 2011 4:43 PM EST up reply actions  

Other than McQueary, pretty much everyone involved has been fired or are one administrative leave.

Had Joe voluntarily gone on leave he probably would not have been fired, but he chose to be defiant and the BoT was not having it. In the long run they were doing what was best for the University and this is only going to become more clear as the details come out, because every detail that comes out is painting a bleaker and bleaker picture.

by Tractorr on Nov 10, 2011 4:57 PM EST up reply actions  

I said evvverrryone

Clean sweep, even the janitor.

"When you argue correctly, you're never wrong."-Nick Naylor

by Hook85 on Nov 10, 2011 11:56 PM EST up reply actions  

and mrs sandusky?

TLR is gone, long live the king

by sportsman on Nov 10, 2011 9:06 PM EST up reply actions  

There is no such thing as "just horsing around" in the shower.

It does not exist, not between a 60 year old man and a 10 year old boy.

He deserves all of this, and so much more.

I find it incredible that you’re suggesting he wasn’t involved. He knew in 2002 (I’d argue it’s basically impossible for him not to know in 1998, but I’ll give him the benefit of the doubt — which he doesn’t deserve), and nothing was done involving the police until a local high school barred him from campus, which triggered this investigation.

Nine years he knew, and never called the police. Nine years and who knows how many children raped (resulting in the University being on the hook for perhaps billions of dollars in punitive civil damages). Nine years of allowing Sandusky on campus and in his program.

How do we know that he and everyone else knew Sandusky was a child rapist? Because they barred him from coming to campus with kids. They didn’t care they he was raping children, they just didn’t want him to do it on their property.

Paterno and everyone else involved are horrible people. It’s a shame that being fired is the worst thing coming to Paterno.

Oh, come on. Don't leave your uncle T-bag hangin'.

by Troll2Troll on Nov 10, 2011 4:23 PM EST up reply actions  

Read this: http://www.huffingtonpost.com/onward-state/sandusky-scandal-national_b_1085201.html

You are just speculating. We know that Paterno did not go to the police. You don’t know if he didn’t follow up with the AD, or if he did. And you have no idea if Paterno knew that Sandusky was a child rapist. STOP SPECULATING to what you think happened.

"When you argue correctly, you're never wrong."-Nick Naylor

by Hook85 on Nov 10, 2011 4:40 PM EST up reply actions  

What are you talking about?
A source told ESPN’s Schad that Paterno hopes to clarify what he was told by McQueary as soon as Thursday. According to the source, Paterno recalls McQueary “vaguely” referencing “fondling” or “touching” or “horsing around” by Sandusky and a youth.

Either Paterno is senile, an idiot, or he knew exactly what Sandusky was. No one with a functioning brain and any moral compass doesn’t hear about “fondling or touching” between a 60 year old man and a 10 year old boy in the shower and doesn’t know exactly what’s going on. This is information that Paterno has himself admitted he knew. Who knows what he actually knew.

If he went to the police, why hasn’t he said so in his defense? Why talk about how you knew about fondling, but not that you called the cops? Why wouldn’t he say that he called the police when the BoT were about to fire him?

I don’t give a damn if he followed up with the AD. Nine years is infinitely long enough to know that Curley wasn’t going to do anything.

Oh, come on. Don't leave your uncle T-bag hangin'.

by Troll2Troll on Nov 10, 2011 4:51 PM EST up reply actions  

Also, IIRC, the police chief has already said

that they were never notified.

Oh, come on. Don't leave your uncle T-bag hangin'.

by Troll2Troll on Nov 10, 2011 4:53 PM EST up reply actions  

horsing around and fondling/touching are two completely different things. Way to go ESPN.

No one with a functioning brain and any moral compass doesn’t hear about "fondling or touching" between a 60 year old man and a 10 year old boy in the shower and doesn’t know exactly what’s going on.

What if he said “horsing around”? A 60 year old man “horsing around” with a 10 year old, does not scream child rapist to me.

I know a person who works high up in the Pinellas County School system who is often quoted in the news. There has been numerous occasions when the periodicals twist his words or leave out things altogether to make the article have more controversy in it.

My point is, something is not right from the start…McQueary going to Joe and then to Joe informing his bosses and then some how nothing else happens for 10 years. So lets not rely on the media for the facts.

Its obvious there was some sort of cover up. The fact that Paterno has not been indicted leads me to believe there is no evidence or evidence that he was not involved in it. I think until more factual information comes out we should all be patient and refrain from judging and stop speculating, at least give Paterno that, I think hes earned a little bit of benifit of doubt with his 61 years of impeccable behavior on and off the field as a role model and “father figure” to all of his peers.

"When you argue correctly, you're never wrong."-Nick Naylor

by Hook85 on Nov 11, 2011 12:22 AM EST up reply actions  

In reporting the incident up the chain and cooperating with the Grand Jury,

Paterno satisfied the legal requirements of action for a person in that situation and thereby avoided criminal indictment. The AD and VP of Finance, on the other hand, were caught lying to the Grand Jury, and were indicted. Further, I find myself wondering whether Joe could have given more detailed testimony about his conversation with McQueary had he been asked to give a deposition on the matter closer to its occurrence rather than years later. Because everyone involved failed to bring in law enforcement to investigate that incident, the question can never be answered satisfactorily.

Paterno is far from the most culpable person in this situation, but he arguably had more power than anyone else to see something done about the situation because of his iconic status. He could have encouraged McQueary to contact the police. He could called them himself. He could have barred Sandusky from using PSU facilities until the matter was resolved. He could have demanded answers from the administration. He could have reached out to the alleged victim. Instead, he did none of the above. The Grand Jury Report (Facts! Hooray!) does not make it seem that Joe was involved in actively covering up the incident, but he chose to let sleeping dogs lie when he should have stood up for justice, and to me that represents a moral failure so immense it defies description. At that point, the man needed to resign his post, as leadership and ethics that transcend any mere sport had taken a back seat to maintaining the status quo.

McQueary deserves a great deal more criticism than he’s received to this point. If his testimony is accurate, he saw a child being abused in the worst way imaginable and literally did nothing to stop it. He must also resign, as his cowardice in refusing to either confront Sandusky immediately or call 911 allowed university administrators the opportunity to either bungle (charitable me) or stifle (cynical me) the investigation. Unfortunately, his is not a recognizable face while Paterno is a legend. Given the choice, media will mostly go after the recognizable figure.

My anti-drug is football, because sometimes it is a better hallucinogen than anything you can get at Burning Man. - Spencer Hall 9/28/11

by car.full.of.midgets on Nov 11, 2011 9:29 AM EST up reply actions  

I don’t think there is any thing else more to say. I agree with pretty much every thing you have to say. I just think there is so much variance in the story, it is not a fact to say Joe Pa just turned a blind eye and leave it at that. Although I admit, it does seem that way and Joe woud not be in this mess if any ONE of the people just called the police…especially McQuary.

"When you argue correctly, you're never wrong."-Nick Naylor

by Hook85 on Nov 11, 2011 4:22 PM EST up reply actions  

I find it incredible that you’re suggesting he wasn’t involved. He knew in 2002

I don’t know for sure. If I were to speculate, IMO I don’t think Paterno was involved in a cover up.

"When you argue correctly, you're never wrong."-Nick Naylor

by Hook85 on Nov 10, 2011 4:44 PM EST up reply actions  

Paterno does not get the benefit of the doubt.

He should have never let Sandusky anywhere NEAR his football program or his university ever again after being told what he was allegedly told in 2002. The fact that Sandusky was seen using the football training facilities as recently as LAST WEEK clearly shows what Paterno’s priorities were. And his priorities were to not kick up a hornet’s nest. I have no sympathy for the man at all, am shocked that he didn’t have the decency to resign IMMEDIATELY and even had to be fired, and am also shocked that the rest of the coaching staff (especially McQueary) have not been given their walking papers as well. This is a serious issue that goes well beyond football. If I were the Board of Trustees, I would strongly consider canceling the rest of the football season, getting rid of all the staff, and starting over with a clean slate next year. This is one of those reputation hits that doesn’t go away for a generation.

Penn State allowed a KNOWN (allegedly) child molestor to use campus facilities for the purpose of running a charity that would put him in contact with more young children for almost 10 years. And that’s assuming they didn’t already know in 1998 when he had to suddenly resign. Hell they even gave the guy an office. This was a complete failure of not only all involved with the football program, but the university administration as well.

by Cali Gators on Nov 10, 2011 6:47 PM EST reply actions  

If McQueary told Paterno that he saw Sandusky raping (touching, fondling, anything in that manner) a 10 year old boy and IF Paterno took a blind eye to the incident for what ever reasoning: Than, I will completley agree with everything you are saying.

The fact that we don’t even know what McQueary told Paterno, We dont know what went on between Paterno and his bosses after the alleged incident. It seems obvious there was a cover up and Paterno could of been made to believe that Sandusky was innocent by his bosses or he could of been part of it, or he could of just been ignorant. Without knowing any of this for sure, why doesn’t Paterno get the benifit of doubt, at least until a real investigation occurrs and what he was told in 2002.

Even the interim HC sent out a mass email to all alumni and the sorts in part of the email he reccomends everyone not to speculate until everything is made clear.

"When you argue correctly, you're never wrong."-Nick Naylor

by Hook85 on Nov 11, 2011 12:44 AM EST up reply actions  

Don’t we already know that he did at the very least say he saw inappropriate behavior by Sandusky in a shower with a 10 year old boy? Just because we don’t know how specific he got into the details with Paterno, what more would YOU need to be told in order to come to the conclusion that something is very wrong with that? I mean Paterno has already admitted as much that he was told at least that much. If Paterno was given specifics back in 2002 that only makes it worse, but even if he wasn’t that does not exonerate him in any way, shape, or form.

by Cali Gators on Nov 11, 2011 12:31 PM EST up reply actions  

I'm glad Alligator Army seems to be mostly populated by adults

Because reading some of the reactions to this story at places like Black Shoe Diaries makes me physically ill. The reaction there and other places seem to be coming from a place where people have elevated Joe Pa to a place of super-human admiration. Because of this, they perceive any slight against him as a somehow beyond the pale and patently insulting.

The fact of the matter is that the Board of Trustees didn’t make Joe Pa the scapegoat. He sealed his own fate in 2002 when he passed the buck, and in 2011 when he thought he could dictate what the Board could or could not do regarding his own employment. It seems to me like the decision to fire every single person involved in the matter would have been a no-brainer. (To answer the inevitable question: I think the only way McQueary or any other involved parties weren’t immediately fired was for legal reasons. PSU is going to be sued for a whole lot of money in the coming years; they didn’t want to add any more potential employment lawsuits on top of that.)

by CanWeBeMature on Nov 10, 2011 10:01 PM EST reply actions  

I’m glad Alligator Army seems to be mostly populated by adults.

Are you saying, that because I don’t agree with your point of view like the people at Black Shoe Diaries you do not view me as an adult?

Everything I have said, and many comments at BSD have very legitimate points. And I don’t appreciate your sly back handed remark.

"When you argue correctly, you're never wrong."-Nick Naylor

by Hook85 on Nov 11, 2011 12:29 AM EST up reply actions  

i don’t know about you specifically, but a lot of people over at BSD and elsewhere came off as remarkably naive when faced with the knowledge that Joe Pa could have had such a massive lapse in judgment with the handling of the whole situation. Instead of taking a step back and realizing that Joe Pa, while having an otherwise unimpeachable record, might have been horribly in the wrong in this case, many people became defensive and decided to rail on issues that I thought were completely irrelevant, like the way Joe Pa was fired.

by CanWeBeMature on Nov 11, 2011 1:52 AM EST up reply actions  

In reading the first 10 or so pages of the Grand Jury report, there are a lot of holes. Personally, I would like to let the whole thing play out. Sandusky has not been convicted of anything else, so even he is innocent until proven guilty, as much as we hate that.

McQueary’s story is completely different from the PSU administrators, so it’s not really clear what he told anyone. His response to the situation makes more sense if he is lying and the other men are telling the truth. Otherwise, why not break up Sandusky and the young boy, or at least call the police? Why wait until the next day, and then complicate things by involving Paterno? Something about that response says it was not as serious as he now claims. If anything, his head should have been the first to roll, but my guess is that since he was a GA when this happened, he was not an employee of the university, so the process of firing him is more complicated, since this would have occurred previous to his employment by the university.

The other issue is the high school. Some seem to assume that because the high school banned Sandusky, he was guilty. But this is not necessarily true. The high school does not have to conduct an investigation to ban someone. They can make a gut-level reaction, and often their reaction is wrong. Trust me, I had a friend get fired after being accused of assaulting a kid at a high school football game. He was later ruled to be not guilty by a mediator after the evidence against him collapsed, but he lost his job anyways.

I don’t know what to make of it all yet, and I’m not ready to rush to judgment. If McQueary is telling the truth, then the proper thing to do would be to fire him and all involved. But until that is clear, let’s not let the media talking heads be judge, jury, and executioner. At the end of the day, we want justice, and rushing to judgment and searching for PR-driven solutions are not justice, but a miscarriage of justice. Don’t miss this. We want justice, and that means justice for everyone involved, even the accused and any who might have been involved in a cover up or failure to report.

by Andrew Nordine on Nov 11, 2011 11:39 PM EST reply actions  

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